That is not true at all. About half of the gas power plants in your whole state are in Maricopa County and with a number of them being right in the Phoenix area.
LOVE IT or HATE IT? JEEP's New Slogan - “Zero Emission Freedom”
- Thread starter wayoflife
- Start date
WJCO
Meme King
What cracks me up is how the catalytic converter supposedly was the grand fix for emissions since the 1970s. So much so that the government gets to fuck us in the ass every year or two to make sure our tailpipe isn't toxic but suddenly now 40ish years later, that isn't good enough now. Wake the fuck up, people.
LOL - exactly!
And really, that's my whole problem with all this electric crap. I just don't feel like we're allowed to have an honest discussion about it. None of it makes sense and if you question or worse, disagree with the products of propaganda, you're some kind of science denier who is hell bent on making people breath dirty air, drink dirty water and destroy the planet.
Again, I really like the idea of electric especially when it comes to power and performance. I want to be excited about it - not forced to accept it.
WJCO
Meme King
Exactly. I'm all about embracing the modern advances, but that's not what this is about.
Not even close. And really, I just don't get it. We were able to harness the power of the atom, send men to the moon but somehow, the best we can do in 2021 is make a Wrangler with a 20 mile battery range and we're told to love it because it'll help save the planet.
WJCO
Meme King
Exactly. What the fuck has happened to this "America?"Not even close. And really, I just don't get it. We were able to harness the power of the atom, send men to the moon but somehow, the best we can do in 2021 is make a Wrangler with a 20 mile battery range and we're told to love it because it'll help save the planet.
OverlanderJK
Resident Smartass
lol of course that’s your answer.
Oh man, don't even get me started.
What I will say, is that there was once a time when America took on any and every problem head on. There was nothing we couldn't solve especially through science and technology. Today, the only answer we're allowed to entertain regarding problems such as pollution, is abstinence.
AZVAJKU
Hooked
Amen on the power of the American Free Market. 
Government mandating shit is not the solution.
Some simple research on how much additional electricity will be needed in order to power all the new EV cars illustrates how this transition away from ICE vehicles is NOT realistic.
Additionally the demand for ‘Rare Earth’ minerals required to manufacture the batteries need to convert all the worlds existing vehicles to EV exceeds the world’s known reserves of these materials.
The bottom line is if this BS is carried out most individuals will NOT be able to own an automobile due to the incredible high price, instead most people will be forced to rely on government mass transportation. Don’t worry though, the government is here to take care of you. The government is full of super smart people who have it all figured out and they never make any mistakes.
Government mandating shit is not the solution.
Some simple research on how much additional electricity will be needed in order to power all the new EV cars illustrates how this transition away from ICE vehicles is NOT realistic.
Additionally the demand for ‘Rare Earth’ minerals required to manufacture the batteries need to convert all the worlds existing vehicles to EV exceeds the world’s known reserves of these materials.
The bottom line is if this BS is carried out most individuals will NOT be able to own an automobile due to the incredible high price, instead most people will be forced to rely on government mass transportation. Don’t worry though, the government is here to take care of you. The government is full of super smart people who have it all figured out and they never make any mistakes.
OverlanderJK
Resident Smartass
if the government is all about green energy why not target there own fleet (military vehicles) to some sort of green energy instead of vehicles that get 2mpg?
It's hard not to think, that IS the plan.The bottom line is if this BS is carried out most individuals will NOT be able to own an automobile due to the incredible high price, instead most people will be forced to rely on government mass transportation. Don’t worry though, the government is here to take care of you. The government is full of super smart people who have it all figured out and they never make any mistakes.
JK_0311
Member
You are correct, we should be incentivizing clean (hopefully nuclear power) to support the grid. And manufacturing of anything will produce a byproduct, so the argument is neutral there.
JK_0311
Member
Umm, my point exactly? That a LOT of the crap you see in the air is in fact from construction dust and not just car emissions.
Wow... I mean, just wow. You really don't get it.
I really had no idea this would be so hard for you to understand but please, try to follow me for just a second here. A majority of electric power plants in Arizona are run on coal and gas and with about half of gas ones being in Maricopa county - you know, where Phoenix is. Burning gas produces air pollution. If all cars ran on electricity, MORE electricity would need to be produced and that would mean even more gas would need to be burned. Even if it's a Duracell, you can't just take a pair of AA batteries and use them to light up your whole house, turn on your TV, run your computer and charge up your phone.
Coal power is not made any where near Maricopa county and if you know about natural gas plants, they are not base load power - meaning they only ramp up for demand power, typically in the afternoon of summer months when energy is critical for cool air in houses. Most of the time, outside of peak demand summer, they sit without operating. When I hike the mountains at 7am the brown cloud is from commuter traffic, disputing this is ignorance. Oh and AZ biggest energy provider is moving to 100% clean energy, so NG/Coal won’t be an issue soon.
I didn’t think this would be that hard for you to comprehend either, but here we are discussing such things.
I guess I leave with this, if you believe that NG is polluting the air, then you agree ICE are too. So less ICE cars/trucks means better air quality - just like less NG plants? Right?
I understand you live in a rural area, how would you feel if I dropped 4-5 million commuters there between the house of 6-9am and 4-6pm? I’m sure you’d love that.
If we remove all ICE cars/trucks from the roads then the air quality will be better, so reducing some will help - common sense says so? Why is this so hard to grasp or complain about? We could do this all day, but I think my logic is clear and fair.
Ummm, I realize that reading isn't a strong point of yours but for the record, I NEVER said they were.
LOL - because Phoenix is only hot in June, July and August. But hey, you're the expert here.
LOL - says the guy who said if "you’ve never done construction in Maricopa - Dust will shut a job site down".
You mean like every state in the union has been moving toward for over a decade now. Yeah, it'll be any day now LOL
Awe, guess I struck a nerve with that one. Sorry about that LOL
Uh, DUH! That was my point boy genius.
Not sure how you have less gas plants when all cars need to be running on electricity but hey, you're the guy who knows all about things like what the EPA has in store for us in spite of NOT reading a damn thing.
LOL - Yup, I sure do and never wouldn't have a clue what it would be like to live in an area with almost 10 million people and for longer than you've been alive.
Only IF electric production was made by more than 14% from renewable sources. Sucks that isn't the case now nor will it be in the next 5 years.
Why all this is so hard for you to grasp is clear as day to me. Just like all the products of propaganda, you have to be right and I have to be wrong. And that's cool. You win, batteries are just a harmless waste product of energy, there are no gas power plants in Phoenix or there are but only turn on during June, July and August, construction dust can shut a job site down but isn't a contributor to the brown cloud and driving Jeeps that have a 20 mile battery range will end air pollution as we know. Got it.
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MostlyStockJK
New member
You must’ve voted for Biden and probably wear a mask while jeeping
Brute
Hooked
Catalytic converters are so great people are stealing them...poor man’s Bitcoin...
bobfriesenhahn
Hooked
Do those "renewable" sources include hydroelectric power such as from Hoover dam on the Colorado River (now generating at 60% of normal capacity)?All I can tell you is that the truth is out there. This is not Fox news or some other rightwing propaganda, this is directly from the California Energy Commission.
View attachment 364935
https://www.energy.ca.gov/data-reports/california-power-generation-and-power-sources
And, for those of you in Arizona, this is from the EIA - U.S. Energy Information Administration and they give a more rosy number by saying "more than half" of the 14% of renewable energy produced is from solar.
View attachment 364936
Those are actual and factual numbers and the rest of the electricity has to come from somewhere. I'll be interested to see what these numbers look like in 4 years when most every new car made will need to be run off of electricity.
Yes, including hydroelectric, TOTAL renewable power production is only 14% in the state of Arizona.
OverlanderJK
Resident Smartass
How do we charge millions of cars if we have a hard time just keeping the damn AC on?