DEATH WOBBLE : What it is, What it isn't and What You Can Do to Fix it

hdawgn40 said:
Well you were one for one with my evo skid and muffler issue so I do hold your advice in the highest regard......everyday I learn something new about these jk's and pass my knowledge on to others and I want my information to be correct I'm in no way, shape our form saying that your info is not accurate I was convinced that that was the issue until you left that message it made me go out and look at my suspension on my new jeep lol

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LOL!! Well, I'm glad you didn't take what I was saying the wrong way as that it wasn't my intent. It's tough for me especially being at a place like SEMA like I am now where I get to talk to all these manufacturers and know the kind of BS they pull. A times, it can make it real hard for me to do it with smile.
 
I just wanted to throw this out there. My son bought a 4" RC lift and already had to replace his track bar and shocks after less than 2 years and maybe 5 times wheeling and I'm talking easy trails. Maybe harsh parking lots also.

Tom
 
I am getting some wobble now after about 14k miles and a week long trip to CO and Moab. I have torqued everything to 125 and no correction and replaced my bolts with 9/16 during the lift install. I have a synergy high steer kit going in this weekend to hopefully help.

Any additional advice? Going to see if I can get a good alignment soon if nothing else helps me.
 
Death Wobble - This is the best thread I have seen. It helped me fix mine.

First off, thanks for sharing this insightful knowledge about resolving and providing an understanding of the death wobble issue. Without this direction I would have spent thousands at a shop to get it fixed.

I have a 2006 Jeep Wrangler TJ. It has 33" tires, 4" suspension lift and a 1.25" body lift. I use it for light trails occasionally getting a little wild. I hit the mud pit once, first and last time as clean up was a bear and you can't see whats under the mud.

So, at some point at 40-50 the death wobble started. I believe it was after mudding and hitting a hole that jacked my alignment up, and so I had the dealer re-align. Still the death wobble. Now, when I say death wobble it is the wobble that violently shakes from the front of the vehicle to the back so much so that my rear shock mount ripped off the rear axle, there was no powering through it that time. I have powered through 40-50 to get me home but it's sketchy to say the least.

So, this thread listed check the track bar and look for anything shiny on the front suspension. Sure enough, the lift kit has this drop mount of the driver side frame for the track bar to connect to, it looked solid, but there was shiny metal on the outside where the sway bar is.
I had my son turn the steering wheel left and right, and sure enough the 3 bolts while super tight, there was play about 1/4" in the track bar. Easy fix was to weld it to the frame. By the way, first pass was to weld the rear bracket to the frame as well which reduced the wobble from 100% to 85%, no longer tearing off shock mounts. After welding the front mount onto the frame the death wobble reduced to 15% of a death wobble, I will call it a slight wobble coming from the front right manifesting the feel in the steering wheel. The next approach was to change to a slightly toe out alignment,
which made the 15% or even 10% wobble go to 0% wobble at 40mph to 50mph. Awesome feeling. I went from wanting to part ways with the jeep to being stoked about it again. Without this article giving some direction this fix was not possible so thank you!

Another note, I tried messing with the caster angle making it more positive ( by measurement from a chart ) but that seemed to have no effect on the wobble.

So, the originator is spot on. The front suspension must be tight. Look for a shiny tell and fix it. While the toe out is supposed to be a work around to hide something else that is loose, I will take it as now the Jeep is a perfect ride at any speed.



Robert Sims
 
To be clear, setting your toe-out is something that I recommend as a bandaid to get you home but is far from a fix. A Jeep is primarily a rear wheel drive vehicle and because of it, needs to have it's toe-IN as that will provide optimal tire wear. Toe out will help stabilize you for sure but, only at the cost of poor tire wear. If you are still having a wobble, I would double check your ball joints and bearings as they could easily go bad from each episode of DW that you had. Hope that helps.
 
I didn't know where else to find the info I need and I didn't wanna start a new thread for this but... I've been having trouble with death wobble and when I put the evo drag link flip kit on it took care of about 90% of the problem, but I still get a death wobble every once in a long while but it's much more of just a consistent shimmy now with the occasional death wobble. I just found out my steering stabilizer is completely shot. I was planning on ordering the evo lower control arms to correct my caster as my next step to curing my DW completely, but could the SS be the problem? I know a worn SS won't CAUSE DW but if it's just occasional DW, could it be the culprit? Or should I get the lower control arms along with a new SS anyways? I'm thinking a new SS first since that's much cheaper, and seeing how it drives, and putting off the control arms til I get the evo DD long arm. What do you guys think? Thanks in advance.
 
Devallee said:
I didn't know where else to find the info I need and I didn't wanna start a new thread for this but... I've been having trouble with death wobble and when I put the evo drag link flip kit on it took care of about 90% of the problem, but I still get a death wobble every once in a long while but it's much more of just a consistent shimmy now with the occasional death wobble. I just found out my steering stabilizer is completely shot. I was planning on ordering the evo lower control arms to correct my caster as my next step to curing my DW completely, but could the SS be the problem? I know a worn SS won't CAUSE DW but if it's just occasional DW, could it be the culprit? Or should I get the lower control arms along with a new SS anyways? I'm thinking a new SS first since that's much cheaper, and seeing how it drives, and putting off the control arms til I get the evo DD long arm. What do you guys think? Thanks in advance.
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Take off your SS and I can guarantee you that you will have the same sensation only, you'll most likely get DW more frequently.

Since you say that you have a consistent shimmy, I would start by having your tires balanced. A lot of what you are feeling is most likely coming from them and that can be enough to instigate DW. I would then have your suspension and steering bolts checked again for proper torque. Each episode of DW will be enough to loosen everything up. I would then double check that your track bar bushings are in good shape and that it's mounts do not show any signs of cracking or tearing. You said that installing the drag link flip helped? Well, a lot of that could be because your factory mount on the axle was tearing and now the new relocation bracket has stiffened things up. However, if the factory mount underneath is failing, it will let you know. If that checks out, be sure to check the frame side mount as it could not be failing due to the new stronger axle side mount. If all that checks out, have your ball joints and unit bearing checked as they are a BIG source of DW.

Hope that helps.
 
wayoflife said:
Take off your SS and I can guarantee you that you will have the same sensation only, you'll most likely get DW more frequently. Since you say that you have a consistent shimmy, I would start by having your tires balanced. A lot of what you are feeling is most likely coming from them and that can be enough to instigate DW. I would then have your suspension and steering bolts checked again for proper torque. Each episode of DW will be enough to loosen everything up. I would then double check that your track bar bushings are in good shape and that it's mounts do not show any signs of cracking or tearing. You said that installing the drag link flip helped? Well, a lot of that could be because your factory mount on the axle was tearing and now the new relocation bracket has stiffened things up. However, if the factory mount underneath is failing, it will let you know. If that checks out, be sure to check the frame side mount as it could not be failing due to the new stronger axle side mount. If all that checks out, have your ball joints and unit bearing checked as they are a BIG source of DW. Hope that helps.
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I just had my tires balanced not too long ago and I remember still having the shimmy right after balancing although it did help a great deal. The track bar bushings are good I just checked those maybe a few hundred miles ago when I put the drag link flip on and the mounts seem like they're in fair shape. The bushings on my old track bar were shot which is what I think was causing most of the DW. However I have not checked for the proper torque on suspension and steering bolts recently so I will get on that ASAP as well as having the ball joints and unit bearings checked. Thanks for the help!
 
Devallee said:
I just had my tires balanced not too long ago and I remember still having the shimmy right after balancing although it did help a great deal. The track bar bushings are good I just checked those maybe a few hundred miles ago when I put the drag link flip on and the mounts seem like they're in fair shape. The bushings on my old track bar were shot which is what I think was causing most of the DW. However I have not checked for the proper torque on suspension and steering bolts recently so I will get on that ASAP as well as having the ball joints and unit bearings checked. Thanks for the help!
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You should know that it's difficult to balance large off road tires and it's not uncommon to need multiple balancings to get it right. Some tires are a lot worse than others such as Goodyear MTR's. That is really where you should start but, I would definitely have the ball joints and unit bearing properly checked which means, using a dial indicator.
 
I had been fighting DW for a few months recently and finally traced it to a bad drag link TRE after finding Planman's posts on JKF. Ended up replacing the entire thing with Napa / Moog hardware until I can justify installing a heavy duty high steer kit and tie rod all at once. At least I have zerks on those joints now.

Here's a video I made of the bad drag link end:

 
sirion said:
I had been fighting DW for a few months recently and finally traced it to a bad drag link TRE after finding Planman's posts on JKF. Ended up replacing the entire thing with Napa / Moog hardware until I can justify installing a heavy duty high steer kit and tie rod all at once. At least I have zerks on those joints now.

Here's a video I made of the bad drag link end:

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That guys a dumbass.
 
All good advice.

After hearing about the dreaded death wobble, but never previously experiencing it, it was a hell of shock when it happened. I limped home, making sure to stay well below the speed I thought brought the problem on, although it did happen 3-4 more times in that distance.

Sure enough when I got underneath and did a bit of an inspection, there was a loose track bar bolt just as described. I blame myself for maybe not tightening this bolt up enough when I fitted a new adjustable track bar a few month previously.

This track bar bolt is now tightened up to spec (plus a bit), and a full check of all other bolts under the vehicle, and today I had all tyres/rims balanced, and a full wheel alignment also, just to be sure all was in order.
 
wayoflife said:
But, he's a financial advisor that trailers his Jeep and only wheels 2 times a year in Moab. I mean, he's gotta be a Jeep guru :cheesy:
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Well, whatever his story is, I'm relatively new to doing my own front end work and his vids helped me immensely.
 
That said, I've been fighting track bar torque issues since the first time I ever wheeled in my 2011 JK. By the time I solved it the drag link TREs were probably ruined and I didnt understand what to look for.
 
sirion said:
Well, whatever his story is, I'm relatively new to doing my own front end work and his vids helped me immensely.
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Glad to hear it but, the question you should be asking yourself is whether or not the information he provides is actually any good? But hey, what do I know.
 
sirion said:
That said, I've been fighting track bar torque issues since the first time I ever wheeled in my 2011 JK. By the time I solved it the drag link TREs were probably ruined and I didnt understand what to look for.
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How do you know your draglink TRE's were ruined and how did that cause track bar torque issues?
 
Sorry, let me back up. This all started when I lifted my JK. The factory 14mm bolt on the lower track bar absolutely refused to stay torqued. Before I noticed it, it had very slightly wallowed out the bracket and would rattle on turns and on the highway coming home from wheeling. I'd torque it to spec at home and after another weekend out wheeling I'd be back at the same result. Over a year it developed into a shimmy every time it loosened, but not yet DW.

Last summer I hit the highway with my wheels packed with clay/mud and a (probably, as usual) loose track bar and got hit with a BAD shake going 60 MPH. I know this was caused due to unbalanced muddy wheels, but after pulling over, thoroughly cleaning out the wheels it never went away. Soon after that I had full on DW every time I got over 40.

I re-balanced the tires, checked the torque on ALL the suspension bolts, replaced the track bar, replaced the factory hardware with 9/16" grade 8 (which incidentally solved the track bar loosening up). But the DW persisted.

It wasn't until I learned how to test the ball joint on the TRE ends (yes, from planman) that I determined it was the OEM drag link. If you watch that vid I posted (which is ME, not planman) you can see the passenger side drag link end kicking a good 1/4" every time my lovely assistant turned the wheels. The pitman TRE was in the same condition. As soon as I replaced the drag link the DW was resolved. I am on 35s now and all is well.



I've always done my own general maintenance, but never front end work. I'm learning as I go and I meant no offense when I cited another source. TBH I registered here in 2011 and never really visited much. I stuck to old habits and old resources and didn't really rediscover you until a few days ago. Again, sorry if I ruffled anyone's feathers.

Jim
 
I didn't read that whole thing but if you let your issue fester for a year of course you won't get it to torque properly. The bolt is supposed to have a little room in the hole.
 
If you let your track bar bolt loose that long you prob need new mounts also due to the hole getting egg shaped. Can't hurt to check it

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