LS Conversions and State Inspections

cozdude said:
The LS motor is still made to this day. It’s used in trucks and suvs. The LT motor is mainly used in the sports cars. That being said, the short block is the same on both applications. The heads and intake are what make them different
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Correct, but it wasn’t offered in a passenger vehicle and that’s the key to remaining in compliance with federal emissions standards. Robbie will tell you the same. Does that mean you can’t do it? No, but I feel sorry for the shop that does otherwise and ends up with big fuck you from the federal government one day. And as much as people claim it’ll never happen, look outside at the world today and tell me the government isn’t capable of fucking over everyone that’s ignoring that. It’s happening right now with all the good Ol’ boys that did the DPF delete on their diesel trucks.


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Exodus 4x4 said:
All of the AMW conversions I’ve seen have not had any issues, and mine has been flawless from the first star up. I’ve been pushing it pretty hard in the Texas heat lately and the cooling hasn’t been an issue. They’ve done some really trick stuff with their radiators internally that helps a lot with that.

From what I understand on CodeX, there were some issues in the programming related to the axles themselves but that had nothing to do with cooling. I also know that entire build was rushed. Not to blame anyone, but we all know how things end up when they’re rushed. I’m also not a big fan of forced induction on the trails no matter what anyone says, and I will always lead someone towards naturally aspirated if they intend to go offroad with it.
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Okay, to be fair, it was a Hellcat and maybe that has something to do with it. There were a lot of things that I saw that could be blamed on "rushing" things through but most of that was addressed by Savvy. I don't think any of it was a factor in the problems that I saw. Of course, I don't think Jim believes the issues they had had anything to do with his axles. I should note that most of the overheating issues was with the transmission, not the radiator. In other words, it wasn't just the heat but the climbs and shifting.

But again, if you're saying all is golden now, that's good to hear.
 
Exodus 4x4 said:
Eddie is correct that the earlier versions of the Hemi swap were problematic with cooling and I would advise against certain kits, just like I would advise against certain kits for the LS. When it comes to the new platform (JL/JT) however there is no question about it, the Hemi is the only way to go. Since we have dropped the LS conversion altogether for the JK we have yet to install a Hemi in one. I have seen quite a few later model JK’s with Hemis in them and they seem to run cooler, but the fans are running full tilt. I’m not a fan of this in ANY configuration because ultimately the fan will fail prematurely. Most honest installers will tell you as much.


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The difference in the kits for the most part boil down to motor/trans mounts and tuning. The JL fan runs 1/2 or full in the JK because the signal has to be changed to pulse width. The fan is actually capable of much finer tuning and in newer models that came with one it can be utilized or with it’s own control module. Wiring harnesses are now all pretty much the same but early versions from some companies were not so good. The word tuning keeps coming up and it really is a big deal. Wide open hp tuning is easy. It takes time to tune for drive ability. Then add a super charger or turbo into the mix and the math gets more complicated. That’s all the computer does really is solve a math problem over and over. Long story short I think a lot of the hemi issues have been worked through and AMW has done a ton of them. I think they have surpassed AEV as being the gold standard so to speak. Jeep Speed Shop has figured out a lot of the issues as well and is very willing to work with the DIY guys if you are ambitious enough to try it yourself. It’s really not that hard but it is definitely not a weekend project.


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Research all

When I was doing the research to do my 2010 I talked to all of the major players in the swap game . I wanted the GM transmission more than anything . I know Motech can do a 5.3 And I believe a 6.2 LT that is carb compliant in komifornia . Give Robbie a call if he’s got the time he will explain it . I know he has quite a few LS swaps out there that have thousands of miles on them .
 
Irish JK said:
That’s glossing over a few steps in there to say the least. More like tuning big hp is one thing, but packaging it to survive in a full frame and chassis Wrangler is the trick.



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For sure. I was starting to write a book and stopped myself. Open loop/closed loop transitions, air fuel ratios, timing curves. Just a bunch of blah blah blah for most. I did some tuning years back on 4cyl turbo stuff. Learned a lot from people smarter than me. I have excellent retention though. [emoji16]


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A.J. said:
The difference in the kits for the most part boil down to motor/trans mounts and tuning. The JL fan runs 1/2 or full in the JK because the signal has to be changed to pulse width. The fan is actually capable of much finer tuning and in newer models that came with one it can be utilized or with it’s own control module. Wiring harnesses are now all pretty much the same but early versions from some companies were not so good. The word tuning keeps coming up and it really is a big deal. Wide open hp tuning is easy. It takes time to tune for drive ability. Then add a super charger or turbo into the mix and the math gets more complicated. That’s all the computer does really is solve a math problem over and over. Long story short I think a lot of the hemi issues have been worked through and AMW has done a ton of them. I think they have surpassed AEV as being the gold standard so to speak. Jeep Speed Shop has figured out a lot of the issues as well and is very willing to work with the DIY guys if you are ambitious enough to try it yourself. It’s really not that hard but it is definitely not a weekend project.


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I have a buddy who owns a local performance shop. He does a ton of work on Corvettes and other LS platforms including swaps. I think it’ll be his first swap into a Jeep but he definitely has the skill level
 
TxCrushinJKUR said:
I have a buddy who owns a local performance shop. He does a ton of work on Corvettes and other LS platforms including swaps. I think it’ll be his first swap into a Jeep but he definitely has the skill level
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The LS drivetrain electronics isn’t the hard part, nor is the Jeep. It’s when you start trying control things from one side to the other.

Now when it comes to engine selection, be careful. Most people don’t realize that there’s 3 different LS3 options and none of them are cheap. In my opinion, the L9H variant with a LS9 cam is the perfect LS swap. I say L9H because they can usually be bought way cheaper than the LS3, which is what you’ll ultimately end up with after the cam change. Almost the entire engine is the same with the exception of a few components. Plus with the L9H you get the truck intake, which is much larger than the LS3’s intake. Price you out the crate LS3 rated for 525hp, then price a L9H, the VVT delete kit, new springs (blue), and the LS9 cam. That cam swap will put you very close to the same number as the 525 LS3, but for way less money. Go with the Kooks long tube header kit and request weld in mounts. You should also use a Circle D billet torque converter with a 2800 stall. This setup is pretty fucking fun to drive in a JK.

Oh, one more thing about LS swaps in JK’s. Be prepared to drive it every single day, or leave a battery tender on it. There’s a battery draw on the system that is notorious for killing your battery after a couple of days sitting. Never happened on the RPM kits though.


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cozdude said:
The LS motor is still made to this day. It’s used in trucks and suvs. The LT motor is mainly used in the sports cars. That being said, the short block is the same on both applications. The heads and intake are what make them different
Click to expand...
The LS hasn't been used in an SUV since 2015. The only gm that still used an LS was the HD truck and vans. Even that went away now.

The short block isn't the same on an LT. Is similar but completely different than an LS. The LT is a major upgrade everywhere.

The other issue that someone said below is to truly be compliant you need the same model year or newer from the same class vehicle. Many folks don't realize that second part. Ie in a Wrangler to be 100% legal from a federal perspective you have to use a light duty truck (1500) or SUV engine. An LS3 doesn't qualify as that's a car engine. And you can't do any jk after 2015 because that's when gm stopped using the LS in the vehicle classification thats the same as the Wrangler.

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13_gecko_rubi said:
The LS hasn't been used in an SUV since 2015. The only gm that still used an LS was the HD truck and vans. Even that went away now.

The short block isn't the same on an LT. Is similar but completely different than an LS. The LT is a major upgrade everywhere.

The other issue that someone said below is to truly be compliant you need the same model year or newer from the same class vehicle. Many folks don't realize that second part. Ie in a Wrangler to be 100% legal from a federal perspective you have to use a light duty truck (1500) or SUV engine. An LS3 doesn't qualify as that's a car engine. And you can't do any jk after 2015 because that's when gm stopped using the LS in the vehicle classification thats the same as the Wrangler.

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Yeah I never thought about the LS3 being a car engine. Hmmm, that means all those Bruiser JT/JL conversions are even more non-compliant than I thought lol.


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Exodus 4x4 said:
The LS drivetrain electronics isn’t the hard part, nor is the Jeep. It’s when you start trying control things from one side to the other.

Now when it comes to engine selection, be careful. Most people don’t realize that there’s 3 different LS3 options and none of them are cheap. In my opinion, the L9H variant with a LS9 cam is the perfect LS swap. I say L9H because they can usually be bought way cheaper than the LS3, which is what you’ll ultimately end up with after the cam change. Almost the entire engine is the same with the exception of a few components. Plus with the L9H you get the truck intake, which is much larger than the LS3’s intake. Price you out the crate LS3 rated for 525hp, then price a L9H, the VVT delete kit, new springs (blue), and the LS9 cam. That cam swap will put you very close to the same number as the 525 LS3, but for way less money. Go with the Kooks long tube header kit and request weld in mounts. You should also use a Circle D billet torque converter with a 2800 stall. This setup is pretty fucking fun to drive in a JK.

Oh, one more thing about LS swaps in JK’s. Be prepared to drive it every single day, or leave a battery tender on it. There’s a battery draw on the system that is notorious for killing your battery after a couple of days sitting. Never happened on the RPM kits though.


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That’s the start to a pretty good recipe right there.


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