D30 Breaking Point

[wayoflife]

Once I'm out their and have the axle we'll do it might have to have Mel ship the axle to your place,as I figure this will take place on the Rubicon. .Unless you're in Az. of course.

LOL!! No need to do that, we'll have a good time :yup:

I think your Dana 30 would explode into pieces if you tried a hard trail!

(Eddie will love this ^^^^^^)

:cheesy: Actually, there's nothing that sucks more than to have a rig down especially if it's something bad like a ring and pinion and with more 10 miles of rock crawling ahead of you. Trust me, I've been there - done that on way too many occasions and I wouldn't wish or love it to happen to anyone. Depending on the trail, this is why we typically have minimum requirements to help mitigate this as it helps for everyone to have a good time.

true story!

To put things into perspective, we're talking about 4 trails in one summer here. On something like the JKX alone, we'll do 4 trails or more in less than one week. Also, how long are these trails and how many obstacles are on them? On something like the Rubicon, it's 18 miles long and for the most part, it's crawling all the way through. Something like the Dusy is 33 miles long and the same thing. Of course, we're not even talking about something like any of the Hammer trails or the hundreds of miles of open desert that you can bomb through. Please understand, I'm not trying to belittle the kind of trails or wheeling you guys have and get to run, just trying illustrate why we get to see a lot more breaks. Time and quantity have a ways of adding up and biting you in the ass - it's the cumulative effect that gets you. I've never said that running a Dana 30 will cause your axle to self-destruct but, if you play hard enough and long enough, you will start to see its weaknesses. Of course, people can take what I have to say for whatever it's worth. :yup:

 

[wayoflife]

If not done right, yes. Go to project-jk and there is a write up Eddie did on gussetts. Need use lots of wet rags in process

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using WAYALIFE mobile app

Lots of wet rags and take a lot of time.

 

[DELIVERANCE]

Thanks for this thread JeepKeeper. It's a good read for my situation as well. Hopefully I'm contributing to your thread by offering up my D30 experience and I'd also like to jump in with a related question for the experienced guys like Eddie.

My JKUX came stock with 4.10's and the D30 up front, with the limited slip in the rear. It's very lightly modified with a 2.5 inch lift and 35's. I've had it on a few dozen trails, the most difficult probably being Spring Creek and Eagle Rock/Saran Wrap when a bit wet. I'm overly impressed with its capability. This "Plain Jane" Jeep can do some things that seem astounding at first. I have been able to do 90 some odd percent of the things my buddy does leading our trail trips in his two door Rubi.

That being said - the two aforementioned trails are pushing my Jeep probably about to its capability limits. I don't know that as fact, it's just my feeling having been through these trails. Since I'm not locked up, I have to bully my way through some obstacles (Rock Garden for example) as opposed to using finesse like my buddy in his locked up Rubi.

So there is the D30 experience I can offer up. I have done a few dozen trails, a few being somewhat difficult. It has survived and survived well so far (knock on wood).

My question to Eddie or/and the experienced guys:
I want to lock up my front. I do not have much disposable income and honestly a PR44 will likely never happen. But in my experiences over the last couple years I have been soooo close to doing everything my buddies Rubi can do on our trips that I feel an improvement like a front locker will give me just that little more push I need to complete those few obstacles that I have had difficulty with. I also think it could offer me the added advantage of being able to use some finesse in certain instances as opposed to bullying my way through and therefore taking some hard knock stress off my Jeep.

Is locking up my D30 really such a bad idea? Can you guys offer up any additional input regarding this thought process? Real world experience in this situation? Other low financial impact ideas/thoughts?


***Mostly broke and kinda ugly. But at least I ain't got no friends!***

 

[JayKay]

LOL!! No need to do that, we'll have a good time :yup:



:cheesy: Actually, there's nothing that sucks more than to have a rig down especially if it's something bad like a ring and pinion and with more 10 miles of rock crawling ahead of you. Trust me, I've been there - done that on way too many occasions and I wouldn't wish or love it to happen to anyone. Depending on the trail, this is why we typically have minimum requirements to help mitigate this as it helps for everyone to have a good time.



To put things into perspective, we're talking about 4 trails in one summer here. On something like the JKX alone, we'll do 4 trails or more in less than one week. Also, how long are these trails and how many obstacles are on them? On something like the Rubicon, it's 18 miles long and for the most part, it's crawling all the way through. Something like the Dusy is 33 miles long and the same thing. Of course, we're not even talking about something like any of the Hammer trails or the hundreds of miles of open desert that you can bomb through. Please understand, I'm not trying to belittle the kind of trails or wheeling you guys have and get to run, just trying illustrate why we get to see a lot more breaks. Time and quantity have a ways of adding up and biting you in the ass - it's the cumulative effect that gets you. I've never said that running a Dana 30 will cause your axle to self-destruct but, if you play hard enough and long enough, you will start to see its weaknesses. Of course, people can take what I have to say for whatever it's worth. :yup:

Here in the Midwest, the biggest thing we deal with, at least from what I've experienced, is mud, some rocks that are completely avoidable, and some roots/downed trees. The parks that I've been to have trails that are more or less washed out fire service/logging roads, which I know my D30 will stand up to. I was just really curious about if I chose to not avoid the rock gardens and hill climbs, would I blow the front end apart. If I were to make the trip to the rubicon or put my name in the drawing for the JKX, I'd have a fully built rig that I'd have a ton of faith in. From the looks of the wayalife videos, the west coast trails seem to be a lot more technical than our mudslides around here.

 

[wayoflife]

Thanks for this thread JeepKeeper. It's a good read for my situation as well. Hopefully I'm contributing to your thread by offering up my D30 experience and I'd also like to jump in with a related question for the experienced guys like Eddie.

My JKUX came stock with 4.10's and the D30 up front, with the limited slip in the rear. It's very lightly modified with a 2.5 inch lift and 35's. I've had it on a few dozen trails, the most difficult probably being Spring Creek and Eagle Rock/Saran Wrap when a bit wet. I'm overly impressed with its capability. This "Plain Jane" Jeep can do some things that seem astounding at first. I have been able to do 90 some odd percent of the things my buddy does leading our trail trips in his two door Rubi.

That being said - the two aforementioned trails are pushing my Jeep probably about to its capability limits. I don't know that as fact, it's just my feeling having been through these trails. Since I'm not locked up, I have to bully my way through some obstacles (Rock Garden for example) as opposed to using finesse like my buddy in his locked up Rubi.

So there is the D30 experience I can offer up. I have done a few dozen trails, a few being somewhat difficult. It has survived and survived well so far (knock on wood).

My question to Eddie or/and the experienced guys:
I want to lock up my front. I do not have much disposable income and honestly a PR44 will likely never happen. But in my experiences over the last couple years I have been soooo close to doing everything my buddies Rubi can do on our trips that I feel an improvement like a front locker will give me just that little more push I need to complete those few obstacles that I have had difficulty with. I also think it could offer me the added advantage of being able to use some finesse in certain instances as opposed to bullying my way through and therefore taking some hard knock stress off my Jeep.

Is locking up my D30 really such a bad idea? Can you guys offer up any additional input regarding this thought process? Real world experience in this situation? Other low financial impact ideas/thoughts?


***Mostly broke and kinda ugly. But at least I ain't got no friends!***

Assuming you're a good driver and are easy on the skinny pedal, how often you play and how hard you play when you do will still be the biggest determining factor as to how long your axle will survive. If you're running a 10 mile trail with 2 big obstacles like French Creek, that's not gonna put nearly as much strain as would a 2 mile trail that's nothing but one big obstacle after another like Billings Canyon or Carnage Canyon BV. Even at that, it's still a cumulative effect and just a matter of time.

Having said that, for the trails you're running, so long as you stick with 35's and stick with a gear ratio of 4.88 or lower, your ring and pinion should be okay even with your Dana 30 locked up. Where you will see breaks occur will be in your axle shafts. You can help mitigate this with chromoly shafts with full circle clips but, even at that, you're still working with a weak shaft, fewer splines and smaller u-joints. Sure, lockers will make what you though was hard a lot easier and that's where the problem lies. Now that it's easier, you will most likely do what everyone does and start playing on much harder stuff - that's when you'll start to see things break. Of course, if you have nothing harder to play on, you might be able to last a lot longer but, you being in Colorado, you know that isn't the case.

 

[JKBANDIT55]

I ran my D30 on 37s this last summer with trail riding every weekend. I know it's going to go, just a matter of when. But so far it's doing ok I guess. I'm extremely cautious on the trails and avoid any high speed while I'm playing. I did bust my ring and pinion on one of colorados herder trails (liberty) a few months back and had to get towed out for a good 3 hours as two wheel drive wasn't enough to get me up the obstacles. Also my ball joints went bad and installed some new ones. While my jeep was getting the new ring and pinion installed we noticed my axle shafts were twisted at the teeth. Put some new ones in for now till I get a 44 or 60. Hoping this set up will get me through Moab EJS then I should have enough saved up for a 44 or 60. Just going to take it easy on the skinny pedal and crawl like a bug!

 

[DELIVERANCE]

Ha, right on the money! I am wanting to graduate to trails that are a bit more difficult. To be honest - that's one if the reasons I began thinking about locking up the front. I want to do Blanca this upcoming year. From what I've heard and read, I'm not sure my Jeep could do Blanca in its current state.

I guess I need to put this in perspective. Your answers definitely offer me a better understanding for my current situation (I had not considered splines and joints).

I'll need to start calculating some costs. I'm the only income with four kids and a wife so I need to plan my budgets well. Perhaps I can lick up the front but keep an extra shaft around if they are reasonably inexpensive.

Thank you so much for your input. I love the info that I gather here. As an FYI and a general "thank you" I want you to know how much I also appreciate your write ups…


***Mostly broke and kinda ugly. But at least I ain't got no friends!***

 

[DELIVERANCE]

Thanks Bandit. I think that fits right in with what Eddie said. This is great D30 information. I think Liberty might be a bit out of my Jeeps league so it isn't on my short list in its current state. But hopefully some day. Are you familiar with Blanca?


***Mostly broke and kinda ugly. But at least I ain't got no friends!***

 

[JKBANDIT55]

Thanks Bandit. I think that fits right in with what Eddie said. This is great D30 information. I think Liberty might be a bit out of my Jeeps league so it isn't on my short list in its current state. But hopefully some day. Are you familiar with Blanca? ***Mostly broke and kinda ugly. But at least I ain't got no friends!***

I haven't done Blanca but looking on trail damage it looks like a sweet trail! And ya liberty was fun, big obstacle after big obstacle. Can't wait to do it again!

Let me know when your planning for Blanca!

 

[Army_Vet]

To put things into perspective, we're talking about 4 trails in one summer here. On something like the JKX alone, we'll do 4 trails or more in less than one week. Also, how long are these trails and how many obstacles are on them? On something like the Rubicon, it's 18 miles long and for the most part, it's crawling all the way through. Something like the Dusy is 33 miles long and the same thing. Of course, we're not even talking about something like any of the Hammer trails or the hundreds of miles of open desert that you can bomb through. Please understand, I'm not trying to belittle the kind of trails or wheeling you guys have and get to run, just trying illustrate why we get to see a lot more breaks. Time and quantity have a ways of adding up and biting you in the ass - it's the cumulative effect that gets you. I've never said that running a Dana 30 will cause your axle to self-destruct but, if you play hard enough and long enough, you will start to see its weaknesses. Of course, people can take what I have to say for whatever it's worth. :yup:

I do not take offense. I value your opinion; and completely see what you are speaking of. If I were Zach, I would have said that in my response. "this is no rubicon trail" "But I have done X,Y, and Z with mine"

To put it into perspective, the OP was asking about his axle on light trails, and all Zach was trying to show him was that you don't need to worry about light trails.

Bottom line; no offense taken

 

[JayKay]

I do not take offense. I value your opinion; and completely see what you are speaking of. If I were Zach, I would have said that in my response. "this is no rubicon trail" "But I have done X,Y, and Z with mine"

To put it into perspective, the OP was asking about his axle on light trails, and all Zach was trying to show him was that you don't need to worry about light trails.

Bottom line; no offense taken

Correct. I am worried about the light trails. I wanna wheel more often, but with a limited budget, I have to build my jeep when I get some fun money together. I am smart enough not to attempt the obvious hard trails with what I have. My jeep has to get me to work on Monday so I know I still have to take it easy

 

[Army_Vet]

Correct. I am worried about the light trails. I wanna wheel more often, but with a limited budget, I have to build my jeep when I get some fun money together. I am smart enough not to attempt the obvious hard trails with what I have. My jeep has to get me to work on Monday so I know I still have to take it easy

As Zach and I were trying to convey, I would not worry about light trails... Have fun, know your limits.

 

[munstie]

As was said know your limits,and take it easy on the skinny pedal and avoid wheel hop as much as possible,I attribute all of these to my 30's survival so far, if your having fun with light trails that's all that matters. Being in Illinois my jeep hasn't really seen a hard technical trail ,as I play mostly at the Badlands and my Jeep has been to Redbird once and that was probably the hardest it has been pushed due to mud and the hill climbs (almost every hill I was bouncing off the Rev limiter to make it up)

Sent from the"Zone of Influence"

 

[FrankenJeeper]

I've been running 35's on my dana 30 with 4.10's for almost 2 years now with gussets and haven't broke anything yet. The gussets will be my only upgrade to the 30, and I made them myself. It will break eventually but it hasn't happened yet.



This was from a couple days ago from an off-road park near my house. Nothing like out west but pretty good riding for around here.

 

[1BAMFR]

I've been running 35's on my dana 30 with 4.10's for almost 2 years now with gussets and haven't broke anything yet. The gussets will be my only upgrade to the 30, and I made them myself. It will break eventually but it hasn't happened yet.

View attachment 58506

This was from a couple days ago from an off-road park near my house. Nothing like out west but pretty good riding for around here.

Me too!

 

[Army_Vet]

Me too!

Ya! but you don't drive on real trails!!!

 

[1BAMFR]

Ya! but you don't drive on real trails!!!

This one is fun!

 

[JayKay]

I've been running 35's on my dana 30 with 4.10's for almost 2 years now with gussets and haven't broke anything yet. The gussets will be my only upgrade to the 30, and I made them myself. It will break eventually but it hasn't happened yet.

View attachment 58506

This was from a couple days ago from an off-road park near my house. Nothing like out west but pretty good riding for around here.

Not to get off the subject, but how do you like the KC Daylighters? Looking into the 130w spot beams and a driving beam for the center of my bumper mount light bar

 

[FrankenJeeper]

Not to get off the subject, but how do you like the KC Daylighters? Looking into the 130w spot beams and a driving beam for the center of my bumper mount light bar

i love my daylighters. i have the 130w spot beam and its unreal how bright they are.
there are more expensive lights and more advanced lights out there, but for the price, i love them.

hope this helped some.

 

[JayKay]

i love my daylighters. i have the 130w spot beam and its unreal how bright they are.
there are more expensive lights and more advanced lights out there, but for the price, i love them.

hope this helped some.

I would love to have a set of rigid LEDs all over the front of the Jeep, but for the cost it's just not in the cards. Figured I couldn't go wrong with KCs, I think they've made a name for themselves just nice to hear someone else's opinion