Cam bolts

Ok, figured I'd chime in....I changed out my bolts on my first rig (2012) to the shouldered bolts (didn't know better, was new to jeeping,) and could see right away that they fit the holes better. The stock bolts did have play in them (smaller than the hole) if you removed the nut, while the shouldered bolts have zero play. I also noticed that even without the nuts, the shouldered bolts kept the parts they held tight, while the stock bolts, if the nut is removed would just "let go" and freely come out.

Now, there are two things my inexperienced eyes can tell...

1) The stock bolts are technically the wrong size....bolts are 14mm and holes are 9/16s, I can see that clearly....don't really understand why chrysler would do that (same money I guess, probably use 14mm bolts in 100 other applications.

2) The part is being held solely by the torque generated from the nut to the bolt vs a 9/16ths bolt that fits snug and doesn't allow the part to move AT ALL even without the nut (the nut is there only to keep the bolt in.

Finally, I have helped a few local members install some things, and noticed that the stock bolts did indeed chew a little bit of the metal from the mount hole (threads were rasping at the mount).

It seems to me that

1) Those of you that have ran stock bolts without issues obviously maintain your bolt torques a lot more often than most (that never do) thus, you keep enough pressure not to let the OEM bolt move around.

2) It is my PERSONAL opinion that it would have been smarter for chrysler to use a smooth shouldered bolt, as I don't see a practical reason for using a fully threaded bolt in these applications.

Just my personal opinion on the matter, but I don't have the experience most of you do. I run shouldered bolts on my new rig (took them off my 2012 before I traded it in) and my mounting holes look perfect, and the nuts haven't backed off at all the last time I checked my torques.

It is a placebo? Maybe, but again, it seems to me that using a bolt that is the same size as the hole would yield a tighter fit. :thinking:

Just posting for the sake of discussion, not selling anything or telling anyone to do it, I run them because I already had them.
 
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Just out of curiosity, did you change out your wheel studs too? Because, they are smaller than the holes on your wheels and would allow for movement UNLESS the nuts are tightened to the proper torque spec.

All the bolts on my mall crawler of a Jeep have been marked with a paint pen. This helps me to do a quick visual check on them to see if any have moved. I rarely find the need to re-torque my bolts unless I go playing at the mall and climb some of the bigger parking stones.

How completely stupid it is for Chrysler to allow over 1,000,000 Jeep JK Wranglers to get out there with these so called wrong size bolts installed. I mean, it's just a disaster waiting to happen. This is to say nothing about the wrong size bolts on the 800,000 TJ's before it and the XJ which had about 2,000,000 units produced.

Again, anyone who doesn't want their factory bolts, I will PAY you to ship them to me. I WANT THEM :yup:
 
I agree with proper torque also. I'm already up to 4 different torque wrenches in the tool box. Paint maker makes life easier also!
 
I love how every nut and bolt on a jeep is metric but for some reason they should have used 9/16's on the control arms.

Stellar idea!
 
The fact of the matter is, if the right size bolt were the only thing that mattered, there would be no need for torque settings. You could just throw on a bolt, secure it loosely with a stover and call it a day. The stover would prevent the bolt from falling out and it being such a good fit should keep things from moving around just fine, right? WRONG. Fact of the matter is, proper torque is absolutely ESSENTIAL in holding things together and in place. Wheeling WILL work bolts loose. Failure to properly maintain your Jeep WILL cause things to move around, EVEN 9/16" bolts and that'll bring you right back to square one. I suppose at that time, it'll be time to start looking at a 5/8" bolt... maybe 3/4" :crazyeyes:
 
wayoflife said:
Just out of curiosity, did you change out your wheel studs too? Because, they are smaller than the holes on your wheels and would allow for movement UNLESS the nuts are tightened to the proper torque spec.

All the bolts on my mall crawler of a Jeep have been marked with a paint pen. This helps me to do a quick visual check on them to see if any have moved. I rarely find the need to re-torque my bolts unless I go playing at the mall and climb some of the bigger parking stones.

How completely stupid it is for Chrysler to allow over 1,000,000 Jeep JK Wranglers to get out there with these so called wrong size bolts installed. I mean, it's just a disaster waiting to happen. This is to say nothing about the wrong size bolts on the 800,000 TJ's before it and the XJ which had about 2,000,000 units produced.

Again, anyone who doesn't want their factory bolts, I will PAY you to ship them to me. I WANT THEM :yup:
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Well, like I said, I bought mine before I knew better, and thought the play in them was a bad thing. I also don't think it's a disaster waiting to happen, just seems like corporate penny pinching. Im not advocating for their use, as I mentioned in my first post, I bought them when I bought my first jeep and didn't know much about anything in regards to jeeps. I was merely posting my personal findings when I installed the bolts that's all.
 
NFRs2000NYC said:
Well, like I said, I bought mine before I knew better, and thought the play in them was a bad thing. I also don't think it's a disaster waiting to happen, just seems like corporate penny pinching. Im not advocating for their use, as I mentioned in my first post, I bought them when I bought my first jeep and didn't know much about anything in regards to jeeps. I was merely posting my personal findings when I installed the bolts that's all.
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Well, I hope you know that I wasn't trying to single you out and really, used the pronoun "you" to apply to anyone who feels the need to change out their bolts. Did you know there are entire buildings in Japan that are made without a single nail, bolt or fastener of any kind?
 
wayoflife said:
Well, I hope you know that I wasn't trying to single you out and really, used the pronoun "you" to apply to anyone who feels the need to change out their bolts. Did you know there are entire buildings in Japan that are made without a single nail, bolt or fastener of any kind?
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I actually did, modern marvels is my favorite show (I'm a nerd at heart haha.) a veyron consists of two halves held together by only 11 bolts. :)

From my experience building other vehicles, when I saw the full threads on a bolt that didn't require it, I smelled "corporate parts bin" which made bolt replacement arguments plausible. If they are not, no biggie, glad you can save other peeps some scratch for other mods. :)
 
wayoflife said:
The fact of the matter is, if the right size bolt were the only thing that mattered, there would be no need for torque settings. You could just throw on a bolt, secure it loosely with a stover and call it a day. The stover would prevent the bolt from falling out and it being such a good fit should keep things from moving around just fine, right? WRONG. Fact of the matter is, proper torque is absolutely ESSENTIAL in holding things together and in place. Wheeling WILL work bolts loose. Failure to properly maintain your Jeep WILL cause things to move around, EVEN 9/16" bolts and that'll bring you right back to square one. I suppose at that time, it'll be time to start looking at a 5/8" bolt... maybe 3/4" :crazyeyes:
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Just curious... how many folks have actually seen -first person- a JK front end that had bolt hole problems that were bone-factory stock? ( I have not)... I've seen two jeeps with the holes that became oblong... both cases where lifted... which means the bolts were taken out and put back in. That introduces installer error ( I know...) or that the owner then didn't pull proper maintenance in checking torque...

FWIW, I have a lift and use the factory bolts, I wheel mine (though not to the extreme of Eddie or his band), I check my bolts (via the paint marking method) with each oil change; I've not had an issue... my JK has 78,000 miles on it.
 
I can just imagine how many people mess with their track bars and control arms and don't use a torque wrench to tighten bolts back up.
 
jedg said:
Just curious... how many folks have actually seen -first person- a JK front end that had bolt hole problems that were bone-factory stock? ( I have not)... I've seen two jeeps with the holes that became oblong... both cases where lifted... which means the bolts were taken out and put back in. That introduces installer error ( I know...) or that the owner then didn't pull proper maintenance in checking torque...

FWIW, I have a lift and use the factory bolts, I wheel mine (though not to the extreme of Eddie or his band), I check my bolts (via the paint marking method) with each oil change; I've not had an issue... my JK has 78,000 miles on it.
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I have. Helped a local jeep owner install a 2.5" lift and new front track bar. When I removed the trackbar bolts, the threads that were inside the mount had been slightly worn and the metal around the hole on the mount itself was shiny (paint rubbed off) and I saw minor rasping on the metal itself. Rig was 100% stock when I removed everything. Now, I'm not sure if what I saw would qualify as "damage" but I did see the effects described by the "bolt salesmen".
 
Sooooo, bringing this all back to cam bolts, the reason why they suck is because you have to notch out your control arm mount holes changing them from square to rectangular slots to make them work. For the most part, they rely solely on torque to hold them in place and this works fine on a Jeep that never wheels BUT, if you wheel your Jeep and flex it out, the bolts will work themselves loose (as all bolts do) and allow your axle to flop around.
 
Yea, apologies for contributing to the hijacking, this thread is about cam bolts. From everything I have ever read, it seems to be one of the worst mods you can do to a jeep.
 
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