Mopar big brake kit
- Thread starter chad s
- Start date
werks
Member
Glad to help, I've learned a lot about this stuff the last 10 years or so. As a comparison to what we have been talking about here is a quick pic of a modern day 6 piston racing caliper.
The technology that goes into this stuff is pretty crazy! The brake pad is over 1" thick, the pistons are machined from titanium and the entire caliper only weighs 6lb as it is machined from 1 solid block of aluminum. This is the same caliper used on the front of cars like the Corvette C7R race car etc. and get ready for the sticker shock...... are roughly $6.5k a piece:doh: It kind of shows you how much bang for the buck we are really getting with the $400-$1k MOPAR/Crown/Dynatrac JKU brake upgrades we are talking about here lol.
Tanktitan
Member
Thank you both. Your input is very informative. I was looking to buy the Dynatrac simply because I knew I could do that myself. A buddy who grew up in a service station (yeah they really existed) recommended the Mopar for all the reasons you guys gave. I will be going that direction and he gets to help.
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No more beefier. Will get some pics when i get home. Probably just gonna get rid of them. I reused the hoses that came with the metalcloak lift. No idea why they wouldn’t of made them longer
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jtpedersen
Caught the Bug
Also a fellow motorcyclist with time on track, I cannot agree with everything you stated. When brakes are inadequate, yes, larger rotors definitely come into play. Even at street level. Consider the first-gen Yamaha FJR. Reviews stated its brakes were not ideal. Two years later, they put the largest rotors on the front (320mm) possible.
For any given amount of pressure that can be applied, a larger lever ultimately lets you deliver more force. I can only apply so much force to a nut, that’s why if it’s a big job I go from my ratchet to a breaker bar. Some of the brake kits I’ve looked at do basically that: larger rotors, along with adapter to push the caliper out further, increasing leverage, with no other material changes.
jeep_pride
New member
I recently got the Tera big break kit and it was great - it was well needed after adding all the weight on the Jeep. An upgrade over stock is ideal in this department
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I did the rears on mine with the teraflex kit. With the mopar front and teraflex rear it’s unbelievable
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shadowpaige64507
Member
Glad I came across this tread. I was planning on getting the ProGrip brake kit but there was a disclaimer that said they do not work with the Sidebiter II that I have. So I was searching this site to find out what others are using.
From Dynatrac website:
NOTE: This kit does not fit Mickey Thompson Sidebiter II wheels due to the unusual inner profile of the wheel. If you have 17-inch wheels and would like to verify that they will fit with the ProGrip Brake System, click the link below to download the Wheel Fitment Instructions as well as the front and rear brake profile.
From Dynatrac website:
NOTE: This kit does not fit Mickey Thompson Sidebiter II wheels due to the unusual inner profile of the wheel. If you have 17-inch wheels and would like to verify that they will fit with the ProGrip Brake System, click the link below to download the Wheel Fitment Instructions as well as the front and rear brake profile.
shadowpaige64507
Member
Strange I know. Makes me want to take a look at my inner profile...lol
jesse3638
Hooked
This is a great discussion. I think the one thing we are forgetting about is we drive Jeeps. They are performance vehicles in the fact that they out perform others off road at typically slow speeds. We're not pulling 10K+ lbs. Yes larger tires and added weight affect stopping performance. I can't speak for all but I typically cruise at 70-75mph on the freeway and maybe 5+ over posted speed limits around town with the exception of school zones a neighborhoods. I drive defensively and do my best to "what if" while I drive. Yes the Dynatrac kit is spendy but bolts right on in a couple hours and improves stopping power. With the stock calipers and larger rotors I'm sure it provides the driver with the ability to modulate the brakes easier. The Mopar kit looks like another great option and seems to provide basically an entire brake overhaul. One that would be installed on a RAM 1500. Think about the payload and towing capacity of that truck. It's equipped to stop those loads. On a Jeep I feel it could be grabby or touchy. Think about trailer brakes with no load on the trailer, they easily lock up. The only thing I have to compare this too is mountain bike disk brakes. There is a huge difference in a 160mm rotor with single piston caliper vs 200mm rotor with dual pistons. They are very touchy and more difficult to modulate. One thing that has not been discussed is the install of the Mopar. There have been nightmare stories about trying to bleed the system after doing master cylinder and brake booster installs. If I remember correctly the only real way to do it is at the dealer or shop using their computer brake equipment. One should take all this into consideration when looking to upgrade their brakes. Yes high performance vehicles such as sport bikes and race cars need to be able to stop quickly, change directions, and benefit from utilizing cutting edge technology. We're driving Jeeps usually at slow speeds and cruising. I'd choose the system which would get me back close to stock for the least amount of money.
Remember total stopping distance includes 4 components:
Human Perception Time
Human Reaction Time
Vehicle Reaction Time
Vehicle Braking Capability
Look where braking capability lands on the list. Paying attention, driving appropriately for the road conditions, and driving defensively can make up for the lack in vehicle braking ability.
Side note: I'm running stock brakes with 35's and a decent amount of armor. I could have had the best brake system on my Jeep, but the Deer that walked into the road 50' in front of me while I was doing 75 would still be dead.
Remember total stopping distance includes 4 components:
Human Perception Time
Human Reaction Time
Vehicle Reaction Time
Vehicle Braking Capability
Look where braking capability lands on the list. Paying attention, driving appropriately for the road conditions, and driving defensively can make up for the lack in vehicle braking ability.
Side note: I'm running stock brakes with 35's and a decent amount of armor. I could have had the best brake system on my Jeep, but the Deer that walked into the road 50' in front of me while I was doing 75 would still be dead.
wjtstudios
Hooked
I got it:
Drive defensively
Don’t worry about spending money on the brakes and instead add more frontal armor to destroy what ever walks in front of you!
Got it!
All kidding aside, you had great points. And The dynatrac kits a great big lever and works wonders. I am completely happy with mine.
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jeep_pride
New member
Yea - I completely agree! I’ve had great luck with mine. Huge difference from stock - I would recommend this product to anyone looking for an upgrade.
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jesse3638
Hooked
Haha! I do have a LoD Armor Lite stubby with stinger that I'm sure saved me a lot of damage. Good ad campaign for them.
I just think comparing motorcycle and sports/race car brakes to a Jeep brakes is like comparing penis sizes with Caitlin Jenner. Sure there is a need, and they both work just wrong application.
The thread had a lot of good information. At the end of the day it comes down to funds and labor involved. Seems everything everyone has chosen to buy works well for them.
shadowpaige64507
Member
How difficult was the install?
werks
Member
That's a funny comment for someone to make who then starts talking about mountain bike brakes lol. At least our stuff has a motor in it!
All joking aside, what we are all discussing is a type of technology and obviosuly it is going to be much further refined in higher end applications such as motorsports than we would ever need in something like a Jeep but at the end of the day there is a trickle down effect. The basic technologies that apply in motorsports braking systems also applies to any braking system. Just as suspension design and the basic design concepts necesistated by packaging constraints of aero equiped cars like those used in F1 and DP resulted in the creation of and developement of pushrod suspension something that a certain creative mind applied to the rear of Jeep JKU's with the EVO Lever system that I and several others on here run. I'll touch on a couple of your additional comments below:I don't think that any of us are forgetting that we are driving Jeeps. Stopping power is stopping power and if you are going 100mph, 50 mph or 5mph it matters. Brakes are a safety feature and while you can drive defensively, sh*t happens and when you press the brakes because you need to stop, you actually want your Jeep to stop! You stated that you are running 35's. I run Slabs and 37's and a lot of the guys on here are running 40's. Each of my wheels and tires probably weighs 80-100lbs and while we may not be pulling 10K+ lbs like you mentioned with a lot of our Jeeps getting up in the 5-6K lbs range and with the inertia created by those the big 37's & 40" tires rotating our brakes are probably being "stressed" just as much as those of a hevily loaded pickup truck. So if you are slowing from 60mph on an offramp or heading down a mountain side with a ledge close by trying to gradually ease your self over the edge of a boulder going 1-2 mph, when you push down on the brake pedal you do not and should not have to "hope" that your brakes are strong enough to cause your Jeep to stop quickly. I for one do not want to have to worry about "if" I'm going to possibly rear end someone or "if" I and my family may roll off the edge of a mountain because I can't stop when I'm coming down the face of a boulder.
No one is debating the merrits of doing just a big rotor kit like those offered by Dynatrac or the other options from Crown or Terraflex. The purpose of doing these larger rotor brake kits though is not for "the ability to modulate the brakes easier", braking characteristics are dictated by the friction compound (brake pad). The larger rotors are only there to increase the maximum brake force that the system is capable of producing.
Correct you are provided with a larger dual piston caliper also. These use much larger brake pads which becuase they are for a comonly used vehicle are readily available and low cost. Becasue the brake pads are much larger that means that they also have a much larger surface area. So stop to stop you will experience less pad wear than with the OEM pads and the much larger steel backing plate (on the brake pad) will also act like a larger heat sink, disipating heat better meaning your brakes will operate cooler and be much less likely to overheat when stressed.
That honestly is speculations and in fact they are not, the brakes "feel" just like they do if you were to go test drive a Ram 1500. These types of comments though stem from a lack of understanding of how a brake system actually works. Brake pedal feel (as in how stiff the pedal is when you press it) is going to be dictated by master cylinder size and booster. Maximum brake force is going to be dictated by the rotor diameter, swepth depth (how wide the band of rotor is that the pad contacts) and the total brake pad surface area. Stoping power & brake feel i.e. if the brakes feel touchy or grabby is going to be dictated by the characteristics of the friction material compound (brake pad materail) chosen and it's mU (coefficients of friction).
Not if you properly adjust your brake controller lol. Joking aside, unless you have surge brakes the amount of brake force that your trailer applies when stopping is going to be dictated by your brake controller just like the amount of brake a vehicle applies when stopping is dictated by it's brake controller (your foot). If your trailer is unloaded and your controller is set to apply maximum brake force the tires will indeed lock up. No different than if you are going 5mph and you push your brake pedal to the floor you will probably lock up your brakes in everything other than a Jeep with big tires lol.
Again the amount of pistons does not matter, the rotor diameter is what's making the difference. Having said that though the brake system that you install in a mountain bike just like with your Jeep needs to be matched to what is required. Putting a big brake kit on a stock Jeep is complete overkill (and is not what we are discussing here) just like going from a 160mm rotor to a 200mm roto on a mountain bike is overkil. But as you seem to be familiar with mountain bikes if as example you take a regular narrow standard 29" tired mountain bike with 160mm rotor it will stop just fine, that is just like our stock Jeeps with OEM tires. But if you then install a set of much, much heavier 27" fat tires you are then probably going to find that your 160mm rotor's are lacking and you will need to upgrade to the 200mm rotors in order to get comparable brake power as you had before and the "feel" will then be similar.
When you install a lift you also need to install longer brake lines. There have been nightmare stories about trying to bleed the brakes after changing brake lines too, should people not install a lif because of that lol? Bench bleeding a master cylinder before installing it is not difficult at all but just like anything else some people are comfortable working on their vehicles and some are not.
That's not true.
The system that would get you back to something like stock braking performance with big tires for the least amount of money is just installing big rotors front and rear. For that you have the option of either Dynatrac or Terraflex and if you are purely interested as you say "in doing it for the least amount of money" the Terraflex big rotor kit front and rear is about 30-35% cheapest of the two. Is that what you are running?
True yet with the first three all being equal the vehicle with the better brake system will still stop first.
Some things just can not be avoided but i think to use that as reasoning for why one should not improve their brakes is a little pointless. The reality is that the brakes on a stock Jeep to start with already are by no means "great". Put big wheels and tires, a bunch of armor, shocks and what not on top of that and they (I think most of us will agree) are almost scarry at times. While the realtievely modest investment needed to improve the brakes does not look "cool" it is probably one of the best things that you can do to help improve not only the safety of you and your loved ones in the vehicle but also the safety of others around you.
jtpedersen
Caught the Bug
Use Google, "define:adequate" Response will be, "See stock Jeep Wrangler JK brake system."
Even bone stock, I have always felt Stitch's brakes were merely adequate. Currently, I'm running 33s and have added about 500 lbs to him (bumpers, armor, winch, yaddi yaddi). Going down Black Bear couple weeks ago, I would've loved more brake strength w/o less pedal effort.
Not sure when/if lift/tire upgrades will happen, but a brake upgrade is definitely on the list regardless.
Great thread.
jdofmemi
Active Member
Great thread indeed.
I have learned a lot from the informative posts here.
I agree, with 37s, braking is sketchy at best, and better brakes are high on my list of things to do.
I feel I drive accordingly for the conditions, but unexpected things happen.
Just today, on a stretch of 65 mph road, a signal turned from green to yellow. I had plenty of distance to the car in front, but he decided to do a panic stop, instead of going through on yellow.
I had plenty of time to stop, but was thinking "I sure wish I had better brakes".
I have learned a lot from the informative posts here.
I agree, with 37s, braking is sketchy at best, and better brakes are high on my list of things to do.
I feel I drive accordingly for the conditions, but unexpected things happen.
Just today, on a stretch of 65 mph road, a signal turned from green to yellow. I had plenty of distance to the car in front, but he decided to do a panic stop, instead of going through on yellow.
I had plenty of time to stop, but was thinking "I sure wish I had better brakes".
shadowpaige64507
Member
I installed this kit over the weekend. Only had to do the caliper and rotors because my JK had the larger piston in the master cylinder. With the caliper's compressed there wasn't much air to bleed out. Really easy install. Highly recommend it. Purchased on Amazon and only cost about $415.