Evo Double D, Metalcloak or Rock Krawler 3.5" Lift Pro's & Con's.

[Scottyjeep76]

Looking at buying a 4 door and I want to get the most bang for the buck out of my next lift.

I currently have a JK 2 door with a Rock Krawler 2.5" X-Factor Mid Arm lift with Ranch RS9000 shocks on 35" Cooper STT Pro's. It's a great lift and RK's arms are pure beef, ride is nice although I'm not crazy about the springs. It's not a daily driver for me so ride comfort is only a small contributing factor, I care more about flex and droop. Also I'm probably gonna go 37's with the new Jeep as well.

I'm considering doing a RK long arm 3.5" lift, but I know Metalcloak's Game Changer is a nice lift if it has the 6pak shocks. I don't know a whole lot about the Evo Double D kit, so I'm interested to hear about it.
Any and all info is appreciated!



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[wayoflife]

Looking at buying a 4 door and I want to get the most bang for the buck out of my next lift.

I currently have a JK 2 door with a Rock Krawler 2.5" X-Factor Mid Arm lift with Ranch RS9000 shocks on 35" Cooper STT Pro's. It's a great lift and RK's arms are pure beef, ride is nice although I'm not crazy about the springs. It's not a daily driver for me so ride comfort is only a small contributing factor, I care more about flex and droop. Also I'm probably gonna go 37's with the new Jeep as well.

I'm considering doing a RK long arm 3.5" lift, but I know Metalcloak's Game Changer is a nice lift if it has the 6pak shocks. I don't know a whole lot about the Evo Double D kit, so I'm interested to hear about it.
Any and all info is appreciated!

Honestly, I don't get why ride comfort would only be a "small contributing factor". To me, ride comfort is paramount especially being that I spend so much time in my Jeep. Flex and droop will ALWAYS be limited to the length of your shocks and a long arm kit or new fancy bushings will NOT give you any more of it. While the gimicky 6-pak shocks look cool and has a steep price tag to make you think they're the best thing since sliced bread, for the money, you'd be better served to just get a good coil over kit.

 

[Scottyjeep76]

Honestly, I don't get why ride comfort would only be a "small contributing factor". To me, ride comfort is paramount especially being that I spend so much time in my Jeep. Flex and droop will ALWAYS be limited to the length of your shocks and a long arm kit or new rubber bushings will NOT give you any more of it. While the gimicky 6-pak shocks look cool and has a steep price tag to make you think they're the best thing since sliced bread, for the money, you'd be better served to just get a good coil over kit.

Thanks for the response Eddie!
While ride quality is important, I have to believe that the 3 manufacturers do a decent job at making their respective kits comfortable for driving. At least comfortable enough for my driving style.
I'm not against coil overs just haven't done to much digging into them yet. Any suggestions?


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[wayoflife]

Thanks for the response Eddie!
While ride quality is important, I have to believe that the 3 manufacturers do a decent job at making their respective kits comfortable for driving. At least comfortable enough for my driving style.

I guess when it comes to suspension parts, you're a man of faith. Me, I always look at "belief" as being a nice way of saying "wishful thinking". What I can tell you is that coils make up a bulk of your ride quality and your shocks will make up the difference. Depending on how tall you lift your Jeep, correcting your suspension geometry with long arms WILL help improve your ride as well and you'll notice this most on pavement or when bombing across the desert. If all you're really concerned with is flex, long arms are NOT something that you need. If you're not too happy with the ride you have now on your current Jeep, you'll most likely not like going with the same brand on your new 4-door.

I am no fan of the 6-pak shocks and mainly because I have seen so many people with them have leaking issues. Again, for the steep price tag, I would expect them to absorb at least close to what a good coil over will but I have found that to NOT be the case. Of course, if you're just wanting big droop, coil overs will still do this better.

I'm not against coil overs just haven't done to much digging into them yet. Any suggestions?

Before I answer that, what size tire are you hoping to run on your Jeep and what kind of budget are you working with? I see that you live in the rust belt and that alone would change what I would run.

 

[Scottyjeep76]

I guess when it comes to suspension parts, you're a man of faith. Me, I always look at "belief" as being a nice way of saying "wishful thinking". What I can tell you is that coils make up a bulk of your ride quality and your shocks will make up the difference. Depending on how tall you lift your Jeep, correcting your suspension geometry with long arms WILL help improve your ride as well and you'll notice this most on pavement or when bombing across the desert. If all you're really concerned with is flex, long arms are NOT something that you need. If you're not too happy with the ride you have now on your current Jeep, you'll most likely not like going with the same brand on your new 4-door.

I am no fan of the 6-pak shocks and mainly because I have seen so many people with them have leaking issues. Again, for the steep price tag, I would expect them to absorb at least close to what a good coil over will but I have found that to NOT be the case. Of course, if you're just wanting big droop, coil overs will still do this better.



Before I answer that, what size tire are you hoping to run on your Jeep and what kind of budget are you working with? I see that you live in the rust belt and that alone would change what I would run.

Lmao! The rust belt suck so bad, not only is there no where close to wheel but our Jeeps get eating alive by the damn salt. Anyways.

Planning on running 37's, budget wise I'd like to try and keep it under 5K if possible. I'm a "bang for the buck" kinda guy, so if I can stretch my cash and get a decent set up for the next couple of years, I'm down with that.
I can always upgrade down the road.


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[Draconianwinter]

Looking at buying a 4 door and I want to get the most bang for the buck out of my next lift.

I currently have a JK 2 door with a Rock Krawler 2.5" X-Factor Mid Arm lift with Ranch RS9000 shocks on 35" Cooper STT Pro's. It's a great lift and RK's arms are pure beef, ride is nice although I'm not crazy about the springs. It's not a daily driver for me so ride comfort is only a small contributing factor, I care more about flex and droop. Also I'm probably gonna go 37's with the new Jeep as well.

I'm considering doing a RK long arm 3.5" lift, but I know Metalcloak's Game Changer is a nice lift if it has the 6pak shocks. I don't know a whole lot about the Evo Double D kit, so I'm interested to hear about it.
Any and all info is appreciated!



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Like Eddie mentioned the six pack shocks have leaking issues. You literally have to recharge them at least every 6 months. A friend of mine had them and got rid of them after the first year due to this issue. Oh that is if you do very very little offroad

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[Scottyjeep76]

Like Eddie mentioned the six pack shocks have leaking issues. You literally have to recharge them at least every 6 months. A friend of mine had them and got rid of them after the first year due to this issue. Oh that is if you do very very little offroad

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Thanks for the response!

Well then I'm can cross of the Metalcloak lift from the list.
I honestly think that those shocks are what make the MC lift so flexible. The joints themselves don't impress me to much. I could be wrong, maybe the Game Changer is still very flexible with Fox shocks, or even coilovers.


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[wayoflife]

Lmao! The rust belt suck so bad, not only is there no where close to wheel but our Jeeps get eating alive by the damn salt. Anyways.

Planning on running 37's, budget wise I'd like to try and keep it under 5K if possible. I'm a "bang for the buck" kinda guy, so if I can stretch my cash and get a decent set up for the next couple of years, I'm down with that.
I can always upgrade down the road.

I hear ya. I bought a 2-door JK from Buffalo and I was shocked to see what the salt will do. For that reason alone, I personally would stay away from anything too fancy as it'll just be too depressing to see it get trashed. If it were me, I would stick with a good coil kit and run a decent set of shocks that won't kill you to replace as needed. I personally like the ride quality that EVO Plush Ride coils provide as they have one of the softest spring rates out there bar none. To clear 37's, you'll want adjustable front lower control arms to help set your caster and a new front u-joint style drive shaft but really, you don't need much else on a 4-door. As far as shocks go, I'd probably stick with the Rancho's that you're running now being that they are adjustable and affordable so it won't hurt to replace them once the salt you have gets the better of them. You can do all this on the cheap.

Now, if you're really determined to spend more, I personally would recommend the EVO bolt on coil over kit. This will replace the coil and shocks that you would normally get and they can be custom made to give you the ride that you want, will do much better at absorbing big hits in places like Silver Lake and will have bigger flex than you'd see with just longer shocks. You can still get by with just the adjustable front lower control arms and front drive shaft. But of course, that's just me.

 

[Scottyjeep76]

I hear ya. I bought a 2-door JK from Buffalo and I was shocked to see what the salt will do. For that reason alone, I personally would stay away from anything too fancy as it'll just be too depressing to see it get trashed. If it were me, I would stick with a good coil kit and run a decent set of shocks that won't kill you to replace as needed. I personally like the ride quality that EVO Plush Ride coils provide as they have one of the softest spring rates out there bar none. To clear 37's, you'll want adjustable front lower control arms to help set your caster and a new front u-joint style drive shaft but really, you don't need much else on a 4-door. As far as shocks go, I'd probably stick with the Rancho's that you're running now being that they are adjustable and affordable so it won't hurt to replace them once the salt you have gets the better of them. You can do all this on the cheap.

Now, if you're really determined to spend more, I personally would recommend the EVO bolt on coil over kit. This will replace the coil and shocks that you would normally get and they can be custom made to give you the ride that you want, will do much better at absorbing big hits in places like Silver Lake and will have bigger flex than you'd see with just longer shocks. You can still get by with just the adjustable front lower control arms and front drive shaft. But of course, that's just me.

Thank you sir! That's a wealth of information to consider.


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[TheGrendel]

I have a MC lift on my 2 door. But I have the OME shocks not the 6 pack. too many stories of leaking to bother with them. If you want serious shocks, get some Kings or Fox or something else that is proven.

 

[Mike_JK_Houston_711]

For what it's worth, I'm running the EVO bolt on coilovers (set to about 4" of lift) on my JKU, with 37" tires, front lower adjustable control arms, front JE Reel driveshaft and the ride is FANTASTIC on and off road. This is just to hold me over until I upgrade to the EVO DD high clearance long arms. Good luck!

Edit: And the setup I'm running now would fall right at your $5K budget, if you DON'T add in the labor costs of the coilovers install.

 

[chitown35]

FYI if you're going to piece something together, the Metalcloak arms and their zinc coating don't seem to mind the midwest winters.
As far as the 6paks go, yes, they are a whole new ballgame to handle in terms of figuring out how to allow for the up-travel they'll give you, and yes buying a nitrogen kit to recharge as needed. But honestly coilovers would be too if you do it right in terms of find the right springs for your weight, moving your shock mounts, addressing clearances, etc. (Btw not getting into or saying 6paks are better, just comparing the setup involved and price). And I don't see the point to the bolt on stuff. If you only do the evo bolt on kit you end up with 12" coilovers for $4,000 when you could just get some standard 11" travel shocks for a lot cheaper, so how much $ is that extra inch worth if the shock travel is your main concern?

 

[White Russian]

I'm running the Evo coil over kit with all metalcloak arms and love it


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[wayoflife]

And I don't see the point to the bolt on stuff. If you only do the evo bolt on kit you end up with 12" coilovers for $4,000 when you could just get some standard 11" travel shocks for a lot cheaper, so how much $ is that extra inch worth if the shock travel is your main concern?

You don't see the point because you don't really understand how things work. In order to run a longer shock, you NEED to run a taller lift OR have little to no usable uptravel. The bolt-on coil over kit relocates the upper mounting point higher so that you can still retain a lower stance. Also, this is to say NOTHING about the fact that coil overs allow you to run 2 different spring rates and that'll give you the ablity to have a softer coil that provides a nice ride normal/medium use AND then have a timed second heavier coil kick in to soak up bigger hits. Of course, you can also have the valving set to your taste and then there's the ability to adjust your ride height as needed too. There simply is NO comparing a longer shock and coil to a coil over system.

That being said, I personally wouldn't recommend spending that much money on something that would see very little use and would be destroyed by the first winter it sees.

 

[chitown35]

You don't see the point because you don't really understand how things work. In order to run a longer shock, you NEED to run a taller lift OR have little to no usable uptravel. The bolt-on coil over kit relocates the upper mounting point higher so that you can still retain a lower stance. Also, this is to say NOTHING about the fact that coil overs allow you to run 2 different spring rates and that'll give you the ablity to have a softer coil that provides a nice ride normal/medium use AND then have a timed second heavier coil kick in to soak up bigger hits. Of course, you can also have the valving set to your taste and then there's the ability to adjust your ride height as needed too. There simply is NO comparing a longer shock and coil to a coil over system.

That being said, I personally wouldn't recommend spending that much money on something that would see very little use and would be destroyed by the first winter it sees.

LOL! You can run an 11" travel OME shock on a 3.5" lift (bolt on CO kit is "3-5 inches") and gain 1.5" of uptravel over stock. If you want even more uptravel vs down you could even go with 4.5" springs (still in the same range as the bolt on COs).

Yeah there are other benefits to the coilovers, but at what cost? The OP had said he doesn't care much about a great ride.

 

[wayoflife]

LOL! You can run an 11" travel OME shock on a 3.5" lift (bolt on CO kit is "3-5 inches") and gain 1.5" of uptravel over stock. If you want even more uptravel vs down you could even go with 4.5" springs (still in the same range as the bolt on COs).

LOL!! Spoken like someone who has ZERO experience with coil overs. The OME lift yields MORE than 3.5" of lift and to do it right, you still need to run at least 3" of bump stop extensions. Also, unlike a coil over that has as reservoir and can use up the length of its whole body, a standard shock has to be physically LONGER. Sure you can run a stupid tall 4.5" of lift but guess what, you now need to run 4" of bump stop extensions or more. Well, you can always run less but then you run the risk of over compressing your coils and of course, your center of gravity will be way off. When I ran bolt on coil overs, I ran them at exact 3" of lift and it flexed way better than the stupid 3.5" OME lift that I ran on my old 2009 JK. Oh, the other issue I had with the OME shocks is that the front cans would get crushed up against the frame rail with big flex. This eventually lead to them failing on me. But hey, you're the suspension expert here and what would I know.

Yeah there are other benefits to the coilovers, but at what cost? The OP had said he doesn't care much about a great ride.

Like most people, the OP said he doesn't care much about a great ride because he's never driven a Jeep that has one.

 

[piginajeep]

LOL! You can run an 11" travel OME shock on a 3.5" lift (bolt on CO kit is "3-5 inches") and gain 1.5" of uptravel over stock. If you want even more uptravel vs down you could even go with 4.5" springs (still in the same range as the bolt on COs).

Yeah there are other benefits to the coilovers, but at what cost? The OP had said he doesn't care much about a great ride.

So how much wheeling do you do in Illinois to come up with these great conclusions ?


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[chitown35]

LOL!! Spoken like someone who has ZERO experience with coil overs. The OME lift yields MORE than 3.5" of lift and to do it right, you still need to run at least 3" of bump stop extensions. Also, unlike a coil over that has as reservoir and can use up the length of its whole body, a standard shock has to be physically LONGER. Sure you can run a stupid tall 4.5" of lift but guess what, you now need to run 4" of bump stop extensions or more. Well, you can always run less but then you run the risk of over compressing your coils and of course, your center of gravity will be way off. When I ran bolt on coil overs, I ran them at exact 3" of lift and it flexed way better than the stupid 3.5" OME lift that I ran on my old 2009 JK. Oh, the other issue I had with the OME shocks is that the front cans would get crushed up against the frame rail with big flex. This eventually lead to them failing on me. But hey, you're the suspension expert here and what would I know.



Like most people, the OP said he doesn't care much about a great ride because he's never driven a Jeep that has one.

Fair enough point on the jeep ride.

But I wasn't talking about OME springs, just shocks.

As far as springs go, who cares what they're marketed as, get what will net you the lift amount you want. That's why I hate the lack of info out there about spring rates. And depending on spring material and turn rate you don't need to run that much bumpstop extension. I recommend looking into info on materials and plastic deformation.

Btw if your shocks are hitting something, there are brackets to move them over a little.

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[chitown35]

So how much wheeling do you do in Illinois to come up with these great conclusions ?


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I only mall crawl and had a dealer install everything.

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[wayoflife]

But I wasn't talking about OME springs, just shocks.

Springs aside, the physical length of a shock will determine how much lift you actually need. Also, just because a shock has a specified amount of travel doesn't necessarily mean that all of it is actually usable.

As far as springs go, who cares what they're marketed as, get what will net you the lift amount you want.

Clearly, you haven't run very many springs to understand how different each will yield and or behave on a 2-door, 4-door, loaded up or super light weight. The only way you could know what they will net is from personal experience or the experience of others.

That's why I hate the lack of info out there about spring rates.

Knowing a number won't tell you how much lift you'll have or what the ride will be like.

And depending on spring material and turn rate you don't need to run that much bumpstop extension.

LOL!! Sure, you can run a stiffer spring that won't over compress but then, you're ride will be harsh and you'll never get the kind of stuff you'd need to use up the entire length of your shock. Of course, you can also get a coil that's super soft and won't over compress but then, you'd run the risk of going solid on the coils and that would also lead to a harsh ride. Of course, not like I'd have any experience on any of this.

I recommend looking into info on materials and plastic deformation.

Spoken like a true engineer. Numbers are great but they won't tell you how something will "feel" and what experience will show.

Btw if your shocks are hitting something, there are brackets to move them over a little.

LOL!! Right, because I would never have thought about that. :crazyeyes: