Death Wobble, this is different than the typical stories

bl17z90

bl17z90

New member
I have the AEV 2.5 lift no spacers on the wheels and the stock 32's still on my JK. I don't have the geometry brackets that AEV recommends with this kit. Got it aligned right after i put on the lift but only had them make sure the toe was in, left the caster alone. Only problem I had was when I hit certain bumps while turning to the left just the right amont and at high enough speeds I would feel the steering wheel jerk back and forth for about a second, like death wobble was starting, but then it stopped and I would just keep going on my way.

So fastforward a few months I took my jeep off the pavement for the first time (very rocky terrain) and after that my steering wheel was cocked off to the left and a pretty bad pull to the right, and I still don't have death wobble except for 1 certain spot and I had to hit said spot perfectly for it to happen, so i just avoided that part of the road.

Monday I took my Jeep back to have the toe corrected again and they spent about 6 hours and could not fix it, they said that every time they started to correct one side the other side went wrong. I don't know exactly what they were doing but oh well I trust their alignment guy knows how to do his job. So they said they got it the best they could but woulnd't charge me because they couldn't get it perfect. So I was driving to work today and was driving about 65, had been doing 55 untilt he alignment, and hit a spot that I had the issue where it would feel like the wobble was starting and I actually got the real death wobble this time and had to slow down to about 35 to get it to stop. The rest of the way into work it felt like my steering wheel had a pretty slight shake (not tiny, more than the jk usually shakes but not much more)

Friend of mine said he thinks its possible that i may have bent a tie rod from stress. There are no impact marks on the bottom of my Jeep from what I checked and the shop said they checked as well. There is about 32,000 miles on my JK about 8k on the lift and my trac bar was tight. So here I am I hope someone on here can help me figure out what is going on here
 
The steering stabilizer can stop a DW before it really happens. I'm always a bit skeptical whether or not someone is experiencing actual DW or just a shimmy. I'm not judging you but when you say it stopped at 35 mph I have to question if it was actually DW. Usually to stop the violent shaking you either slow almost to a stop or some say they've accelerated out of it.

Death wobble is a very violent movement of the entire front axel. It is the result of an event that starts it and an underlying problem that allows it. You've stated that a bump initiates it which is common, the other issue is usually an out of balance tire. Once the movement starts, a well running suspension will prevent the movement from continuing. A damaged suspension will allow it to continue. The movement you had previous could have caused the damage by wearing bolt holes.

A loose trackbar, control arm, tie rod, steering box, ball joint or any part of the front suspension could allow the DW to occur. The wobble you had or a violent shock or insufficient torque can allow parts to loosen or damage to occur.

I would start with a wrench looking for loose bolts or movement where there shouldn't be. Something is loose or bent allowing the shimmy to happen to begin with and it could be the same problem or their could be a compounding problem allowing DW.
 
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To agree with Skirmish, having experienced DW myself, the only way to stop it once its started is to slow down to 5mph or less. If you got DW on the highway going 60, I have a hard time believing your front end is still on the vehicle. It is such a violent event that you would break something at that speed. If yours is speed-dependant, you might just be getting a wobble from out of balance tires. Check your castor too. On Project JK there is a "Do it Yourself" front end alignment that should help you out.
 
I would have someone turn the wheel back and forth while you sit in front of the jeep. feel all the moving parts for loose or poping, When I caught the DW i had to replace all the steering. :grayno: It took everything out. That was the only way I could get rid of it. Mine was caused by me being in a hurry and not tightning up the trackbar. The cost was not cheap.

All the JK's I know have their own gremlins in a way. But for your alignment I would check your ball joints, and measure your tie rod with a tape. start at one side and slowly slide the tape from the tie rod to the ground and go across the rod. this will tell you if it is bent. how ever check to see if the joints are worn out first, because you have to buy a whole new one if they are. :mad:
 
The problem is I do not have extra money to fork out for replacing too much right now, I know you run that risk when you wheel but idk I'm going to try to see if I can atleast hold off for a couple months.
 
first off, unless you have an adjustable front track bar or adjustable control arm, there is NOTHING an alignment shop can do other than to recenter your steering wheel and take your money. i'm sorry, but it's the truth. yes, your toe can be adjusted but, unlike the TJ before, the steering setup on the JK is different and your toe will NOT change due to a lift. NOTHING should have been adjusted here.

having said all that, have you or your shop ever bothered to check your front track bar? because, if you really have death wobble, that's where you should have been looking first. being that you've recently installed a lift, you most likely have a track bar bolt that has come loose. click on the link below for more information regarding death wobble, what it is, what it isn't and things you can do to fix it:

http://wayalife.com/showthread.php?...s-What-it-isn-t-and-What-You-Can-Do-to-Fix-it
 
I have seen that thread I referenced it first before posting this one. Yes I have checked my track bar but not for a couple weeks. I will check it this afternoon and if its loose again I guess I'll need to locktite it.
 
bl17z90 said:
I have seen that thread I referenced it first before posting this one. Yes I have checked my track bar but not for a couple weeks. I will check it this afternoon and if its loose again I guess I'll need to locktite it.
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if you torque it down to 125-130 ft lbs., you shouldn't need loc-tite. if your track bar is loose, it will allow for shifting and that could explain why your steering was off. if everything checks out, you really should have your ball joints checked. bad ball joints can give incorrect alignment readings as your shop seems to have experienced.
 
If it were me I'd probably loosen the track bar rock the jeep back and forth and them tighten it back up.
 
Update:

Drove home with a small shimmy in the steering wheel and no other problems but I was going easy on it.


On the way into work this morning I was still taking it easy but it started to happen and yes I was able to speed up out of it (kinda convinient) until I began going around a corner on the highway (left turn still at full 55MPH) and without hitting any bumps it just started happening and I did have to come to a complete stop.

Didn't have a lot of time yesterday but I did take a quick look and found what looks like a spot that may have been hit on the trail, the tie rod looked like it wasn't scrapped but it doesn't look like it was hit too hard either. I assume a slight hit can still bend the tire rod correct?


Any 2 cents on this would be great but it just sucks because I really don't have the time to mess with this these days.
 
A bent tie rod will change your toe and will change your steering wheel position but, assuming your TRE's are in good shape, WILL NOT cause DW. If you have a shimmy in your steering wheel, you most likely have wheels that are out of balance. Left unchecked and assuming you have a loose track bar, worn out ball joints or other loose suspension/steering component, that will definitely instigate DW. Since you seem to keep coming back to your tie-rod, check it. Rotational movement is totally normal - you just want to make sure that there is no up and down or side to side movement. Then, use the following write-up to check your toe-in:

http://project-jk.com/jeep-jk-write...self-jeep-jk-wrangler-front-end-alignment#toe

You shouldn't have anymore than about 1/16"-1/8" toe-in. Once you've done that, you can safely put that one to bed.

Moving forward, I would recommend that you do the following:
1. Get your tires balanced
2. Re-torque your track bar bolts and check the bushings and mounts
3. Have your ball joints checked
 
How about loose clamps on the drag link AND tie rod.....the drag link was even rattling. That shop sucks
 
bl17z90 said:
How about loose clamps on the drag link AND tie rod.....the drag link was even rattling. That shop sucks
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you mean on the turn buckle on the drag link and adjuster on the tie rod? yeah, them being loose can allow for enough movement to trigger DW. if your tie rod adjuster has been loose for a while, the threads could be shot and that would definitely be a cause of DW. but, if you tighten everything up and all is good, i would still say your problem is most likely in your track bar or ball joints. have you checked them yet?
 
The track bar is still tight from the last time i torqued it andI plan on checking theball joins this weekend.

Yes i wasn't wure what the proper terminology was but thats what i meant. I looked at the threads and they seemed fine.

I still have a little shimmy but its the same as it was before so I'm thinking i have eithe had a ball joint failing for some time now or an out of balance wheel. I hope its the wheel but I guess I'll find out tomarrow when i get the wheel balance checked.
 
Shimmies and DW are tough to diagnose on the Internet but there are a finite option of causes. The shimmy itself can be a pain as I've had tires "road force" matched, balanced and mounted that still shimmied between 40 and 50. I had them rebalanced only to find a shimmy between 45 and 50. When I had them rotated it finally ran totally smooth through all speeds. I changed tires and I have a slight shimmy again. Bottom line is even after getting them rebalanced don't count on having no shimmy.

Your SS will usually prevent that shimmy from becoming DW if your front suspension is in okay condition. If everything is tight and proper you should be able to remove your SS and have no DW. Loose, bent or worn parts and DW is inevitable.

Myself, I went for strength in my brackets but I run my rig hard so it was insurance I needed anyway. Upper and lower track bar brackets solve a lot of issues and aren't that expensive. It solved my DW but my issue was a loose track bar that DW caused worn bolt holes. That is the worst part of an occurrence of DW is that it will wear out the weakest part if your front end rapidly. If your ball joint have some give they will be destroyed by the violent shake.

Hope you solve it quick. It isn't something you can put off or it will wear out every component from your steering down through the axel.
 
Checked the ball joints over the weekend and they seem good, had a brain fart and totally forgot to check under while someone turned the wheel for me. Friend of mine said he saw a tie rod bend slightly when the wheels were turned but then back when you let off so I'm gonna check that tomarrow
 
bl17z90 said:
Checked the ball joints over the weekend and they seem good, had a brain fart and totally forgot to check under while someone turned the wheel for me. Friend of mine said he saw a tie rod bend slightly when the wheels were turned but then back when you let off so I'm gonna check that tomarrow
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don't get me wrong but, there is no "seem good" when checking ball joints. either they are good or they aren't and unless you used a dial indicator to check them, i'm gonna say that you didn't really check them. they only need to be off by a thousandth of an inch to be off enough to give you grief.
 
Did not realized that the play could be that little, i didnt mean they seemed ok, i was saying that i saw no play but you're right i didn't use a dial indicator, i don't own one.
 
bl17z90 said:
Did not realized that the play could be that little, i didnt mean they seemed ok, i was saying that i saw no play but you're right i didn't use a dial indicator, i don't own one.
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you should be able to rent one for free at autozone. i would give it another look as you don't have to see it being off to have them be bad.
 
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